Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby BDSMKane2 » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:09 pm

I didn't post in this thread to argue with the same fanboys that I argued with years ago. Keep on fighting the good fight, I'm sure you're getting benefits from being so loyal by now.

If anyone actually wants to find out about the company, NIS is publicly traded and the information for how many shareholders they have or the value of the shares is out there. The company may not be in the billions of USD range(after conversion) that someone like Square Enix is, but they're still in the tens of millions range, which isn't by any means a small company.

Just the NISA subsidiary alone pulls in nearly $1,000,000 USD(after conversion, $947,669.604 on 3/31/13, date of statement) net, not gross. And those figures are three years old, we all know that NISA has only grown since then. Anyone who wants to forgive decisions made in the name of low budgets should be blaming budgets that are unnecessarily low, when they could easily afford to spend a little more and actually do right by the fans. But why would they, when so many fans are willing to accept cheap products at a low budget?

I also don't blame the employees at the low levels, they have no more control over what corporate does than anyone of us have over our own companies we work for. But for any consumer who doesn't want to support a company that pleads poverty when they make decisions that hurt the fans, then they should at least understand and realize the full implication of what is happening.

Addendum: Oh wow, before I posted this, I went and found their results for the most recent fiscal year. The net income of NISA(American subsidiary) was $2,524,019.7213USD (on 3/31/16, date of statement). Congratulations NISA, that's an amazing increase in income over the past few years. I wonder if there are any trends that have been exhibited to explain such a booming growth...?
http://nippon1.co.jp/news/pdf/2016/20160513_3.pdf wrote: Net income(Thousands of yen)
NIS America, Inc. 283,614


Also, since I was looking through it anyway, here are the years in between. For 2015, 139,989(000) yen = $1,166,448.6347USD(on 3/31/15, date of statement), and for 2014, 133,870(000) yen = $1,301,110.9059USD (on 3/31/14, date of statement).

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Rednal » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:25 pm

Eh, income alone really isn't a good measure of what a budget could, or should, be. You have to subtract the amount they pay to NIS, the amount of time they can go between releases to keep cash flowing, various fees and development costs... honestly, I'd be surprised if their budgets weren't pretty tight, still. :lol:
Last edited by Rednal on Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby BDSMKane2 » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:32 pm

Rednal wrote:Eh, gross income alone really isn't a good measure of what a budget could, or should, be. You have to subtract the amount they pay to NIS, the amount of time they can go between releases to keep cash flowing, various fees and development costs... honestly, I'd be surprised if their budgets weren't pretty tight, still. :lol:

Not gross. NET. I stated that clearly.
BDSMKane2 wrote:net, not gross.

Don't try to play it off as something it isn't.

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Rednal » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:53 pm

And my statement is the same for net income. It's not like all of that goes into a storage fund that the company can withdraw immense amounts from whenever they want. More likely, a lot of that goes right back into growing the company.
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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby BDSMKane2 » Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:02 pm

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Like I said, not here to argue with the same fans as I argued with years ago. I'd have better luck trying to demolish a building with my bare fists than convince you or the other NISA Defenders of their fallibility.

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Rednal » Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:07 pm

Well, yeah. :lol: I do believe they're fallible, after all, and hardly agree with every decision they've made. For example, it seems really hard to get decent shipping from their online store if you're not buying much. o_O But you can't really convince me of something I already believe, so... yeah. Good talk!
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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Prinny Supervisor » Mon Jun 13, 2016 9:58 am

shadowmaksim wrote:I've got a question for Prinny Supervisor. In regards to the story and characters, how important is the motivation/punishment minigame?


The Motivation minigame behaves almost exactly like it did in Criminal Girls. It is not technically necessary, beyond a few tutorials, but it will be nearly impossible to beat the bosses (even the first one) without Motivating the girls as much as possible. In terms of their individual character arcs, Motivation unlocks the "Girl's Wish" sidequests that can give you insight into their backstories (and is probably the closest you get to "Romance" in the game).

BDSMKane2 wrote:Anyone who wants to forgive decisions made in the name of low budgets should be blaming budgets that are unnecessarily low, when they could easily afford to spend a little more and actually do right by the fans. But why would they, when so many fans are willing to accept cheap products at a low budget?

I also don't blame the employees at the low levels, they have no more control over what corporate does than anyone of us have over our own companies we work for. But for any consumer who doesn't want to support a company that pleads poverty when they make decisions that hurt the fans, then they should at least understand and realize the full implication of what is happening.


As just an editor, I don't have the budget in front of me to look at here, but I can be reasonably certain that the company's growth translates to us taking in more projects and higher-profile projects (acquiring licenses and working out business deals is really, really expensive nowadays, especially with bidding), not necessarily that every project we work on will see its budget increase by a half-million dollars or something. There's also budget vs. return to look at: if we aren't expecting to make a million dollars on a project (just as an example), we probably shouldn't spend more than a million dollars in budget on that project, even if the company as a whole can "afford" it.
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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby shadowmaksim » Mon Jun 13, 2016 2:57 pm

Prinny Supervisor wrote:
shadowmaksim wrote:I've got a question for Prinny Supervisor. In regards to the story and characters, how important is the motivation/punishment minigame?


The Motivation minigame behaves almost exactly like it did in Criminal Girls. It is not technically necessary, beyond a few tutorials, but it will be nearly impossible to beat the bosses (even the first one) without Motivating the girls as much as possible. In terms of their individual character arcs, Motivation unlocks the "Girl's Wish" sidequests that can give you insight into their backstories (and is probably the closest you get to "Romance" in the game).


Well that's quite unfortunate, albeit not at all unexpected. I still stand that it was easily the worst aspect about the first game due to feeling so out of place in practice and the tedium of having to constantly return to it. It was novel the first couple of times but it quickly lost its luster for me.

Oh well, at least pretty much everything else that I've seen looks to have been improved over the first game. Hopefully the pacing of the story, not to mention the story itself, was improved as well. I rather liked the story of the first game but it did have some rather glaring pacing issues.

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby BDSMKane2 » Mon Jun 13, 2016 6:00 pm

Prinny Supervisor wrote:
BDSMKane2 wrote:Anyone who wants to forgive decisions made in the name of low budgets should be blaming budgets that are unnecessarily low, when they could easily afford to spend a little more and actually do right by the fans. But why would they, when so many fans are willing to accept cheap products at a low budget?

I also don't blame the employees at the low levels, they have no more control over what corporate does than anyone of us have over our own companies we work for. But for any consumer who doesn't want to support a company that pleads poverty when they make decisions that hurt the fans, then they should at least understand and realize the full implication of what is happening.


As just an editor, I don't have the budget in front of me to look at here, but I can be reasonably certain that the company's growth translates to us taking in more projects and higher-profile projects (acquiring licenses and working out business deals is really, really expensive nowadays, especially with bidding), not necessarily that every project we work on will see its budget increase by a half-million dollars or something. There's also budget vs. return to look at: if we aren't expecting to make a million dollars on a project (just as an example), we probably shouldn't spend more than a million dollars in budget on that project, even if the company as a whole can "afford" it.

Perhaps you can help direct me to the titles you're speaking of. I had thought with the loss of Gust titles like the Atelier series to TK and the loss of all IF/CH titles to IFI, that NISA had only lost high profile projects in recent years. What games am I missing that have brought the sort of attention those localization projects used to attract? Danganronpa is the only one I can think of, but I doubt that it alone compares.

I also understand that you don't want to spend more on a budget than you feel you would profit on a release. But any reasonable business would only bid a project if they thought they could perform the job well and within the budget in the first place. It's still on your company if you're going in low and sticking to a minimalistic budget just to turn the highest profit. If you didn't think you could do it right, within the projected sales that you had, you shouldn't have taken the project. Anyone can low ball to get the work and then do a shoddy job in return, that's exactly the point I've been getting at. The fact that NIS(A) has adopted a standard of less investment and accepts providing a diminished product in return goes back to the core issue I have.

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby neonie » Mon Jun 13, 2016 9:54 pm

BDSMKane2 wrote:Perhaps you can help direct me to the titles you're speaking of. I had thought with the loss of Gust titles like the Atelier series to TK and the loss of all IF/CH titles to IFI, that NISA had only lost high profile projects in recent years. What games am I missing that have brought the sort of attention those localization projects used to attract? Danganronpa is the only one I can think of, but I doubt that it alone compares.


NISA doesn't only do game localization. Love Live is incredibly, incredibly popular. It is the highest of high profile at this point.

In fact, you even pointed to this very example in your first post in this thread.
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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby BDSMKane2 » Mon Jun 13, 2016 11:14 pm

neonie wrote:
BDSMKane2 wrote:Perhaps you can help direct me to the titles you're speaking of. I had thought with the loss of Gust titles like the Atelier series to TK and the loss of all IF/CH titles to IFI, that NISA had only lost high profile projects in recent years. What games am I missing that have brought the sort of attention those localization projects used to attract? Danganronpa is the only one I can think of, but I doubt that it alone compares.


NISA doesn't only do game localization. Love Live is incredibly, incredibly popular. It is the highest of high profile at this point.

In fact, you even pointed to this very example in your first post in this thread.

I didn't realize it was that popular, I thought she just had some unique tastes. What other high profile anime do they localize?

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby neonie » Mon Jun 13, 2016 11:36 pm

BDSMKane2 wrote:
neonie wrote:
BDSMKane2 wrote:Perhaps you can help direct me to the titles you're speaking of. I had thought with the loss of Gust titles like the Atelier series to TK and the loss of all IF/CH titles to IFI, that NISA had only lost high profile projects in recent years. What games am I missing that have brought the sort of attention those localization projects used to attract? Danganronpa is the only one I can think of, but I doubt that it alone compares.


NISA doesn't only do game localization. Love Live is incredibly, incredibly popular. It is the highest of high profile at this point.

In fact, you even pointed to this very example in your first post in this thread.

I didn't realize it was that popular, I thought she just had some unique tastes. What other high profile anime do they localize?


Yuru Yuri is pretty popular (Though I don't know how well it actually sells, so I'll defer.)

But also, in games, I've noticed they have Psyscho-Pass (not personally my favorite thing ever but people seem to like that thing a lot.) and Touhou (non-official, but anything Touhou is still very notable and something a company would have to fight for.)

And nah, Love Live is like... There is some fanaticism around that franchise that I have not seen around any other anime related franchise. There is a reason NISA has an almost $200 bundle.

I don't know if you were expecting me to name like, a whole bunch of titles, but NISA is, after all, not a HUGE company. It's not like they're Aniplex or Funimation. :P.

That small handful of stuff probably doesn't look very impressive, but they are all things I feel like you would have to go to bat for to get. (Or in Love Lives case, to keep.)

Edit: Though I would also love to hear from Prinny Supervisor if he has any insight (without going into too much detail) on what titles are/were the hardest to obtain or what projects end up the biggest. That stuff always fascinates me. But I'm actually not sure if that sort of information would be classified or not (I can very easily see a situation in which it is.)

So keep in mind, this is all speculation on my part.


... Except for that Love Live stuff. That's just fact. Seriously. Check Twitter sometime for "Love Live" and "μ's".
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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Prinny Supervisor » Tue Jun 14, 2016 10:19 am

BDSMKane2 wrote:Perhaps you can help direct me to the titles you're speaking of. I had thought with the loss of Gust titles like the Atelier series to TK and the loss of all IF/CH titles to IFI, that NISA had only lost high profile projects in recent years. What games am I missing that have brought the sort of attention those localization projects used to attract? Danganronpa is the only one I can think of, but I doubt that it alone compares.


We still do a lot of Gust and IF/CH releases in Europe. And as was mentioned before, Love Live! is one of the most, if not the most popular anime series we've ever done (and dubbing it, no less). And without revealing too much (NDAs, the industry norm), even the most low-profile releases can garner some extremely expensive projects once different localization companies start bidding on it.

I also understand that you don't want to spend more on a budget than you feel you would profit on a release. But any reasonable business would only bid a project if they thought they could perform the job well and within the budget in the first place. It's still on your company if you're going in low and sticking to a minimalistic budget just to turn the highest profit. If you didn't think you could do it right, within the projected sales that you had, you shouldn't have taken the project. Anyone can low ball to get the work and then do a shoddy job in return, that's exactly the point I've been getting at. The fact that NIS(A) has adopted a standard of less investment and accepts providing a diminished product in return goes back to the core issue I have.


Criminal Girls 2 comes from our parent office, the developers NIS. The chain of command, as it were, goes higher than I think you realize.

neonie wrote:Though I would also love to hear from Prinny Supervisor if he has any insight (without going into too much detail) on what titles are/were the hardest to obtain or what projects end up the biggest. That stuff always fascinates me. But I'm actually not sure if that sort of information would be classified or not (I can very easily see a situation in which it is.)


Unfortunately, that kind of thing does fall under NDA, so I would be unable to give you any names. I can say, however, that the gaming industry is just as...political...as any other major industry. Just because we make fun and games doesn't mean that doing business is all fun and games. People's jobs are on the line over what, on the surface, appears to be even the most casual or inconsequential thing.
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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby dromans » Tue Jun 14, 2016 11:18 pm

Slightly related to Criminal Girls series. I had already asked once but didn't get an answer so don't mind if I ask again.
You guys stated Criminal Girls IO will be censored on Steam. But what about the Japanese release? Censored as well? Does this mean Criminal Girls IO will be unrated and censored in Japan on Steam?

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Ringwraith » Wed Jun 15, 2016 12:42 am

It'll probably be the same version as the originally localised one on PC, because making another version would be a big time and money sink that the game isn't going to make back in sales in all liklihood.
Unless they port parts from the Japanese version (so it has the Japanese text), it'll just be the same as the international one.
Depends, I doubt this will happen, but for example Valkyria Chronicles' PC port isn't even available to buy In Japan.
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