Thoughts about the game...etc, etc (Story, gameplay, characters...the usual)

shadowmaksim
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Re: Thoughts about the game...etc, etc (Story, gameplay, characters...the usual)

Postby shadowmaksim » Fri Nov 04, 2016 2:29 am

I just came across something odd on the wiki page for Kuroe.

wiki trivia wrote:Kuroe is one of the only girls to have a major name change. In English her name, Kuroe, sounds very similiar to her original japanese name, Chloe, and may have been a case of "mistranslation".


I just found this funny since there was a discussion a while back concerning this very thing between Prinny Supervisor and other users where the consensus was on the opposite. That Chloe would have been incorrect with Kuroe being correct.

Any thoughts regarding this accusation of mistranslation, especially from Prinny Supervisor if possible? As far as I've seen, either one works since there isn't an official romanization.

EDIT:

I decided to do some investigation and managed to find a Japanese LP of the game that actually showed Kuroe's name in English at some point. There, it was actually romanized as Kuroe as well. It's shows it on the upper-left corner of her Punishment/Motivation screen.

So that accusation was actually just full of hot air. Then again, I guess I shouldn't be surprised.
Last edited by shadowmaksim on Fri Nov 04, 2016 12:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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razisgosu
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Re: Thoughts about the game...etc, etc (Story, gameplay, characters...the usual)

Postby razisgosu » Fri Nov 04, 2016 10:05 am

I'm not a fan of changing names for the sake of changing them. It's something I'll never be able to get behind.

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Re: Thoughts about the game...etc, etc (Story, gameplay, characters...the usual)

Postby Sleepyprinny99 » Fri Nov 04, 2016 4:25 pm

shadowmaksim wrote:I just came across something odd on the wiki page for Kuroe.

wiki trivia wrote:Kuroe is one of the only girls to have a major name change. In English her name, Kuroe, sounds very similiar to her original japanese name, Chloe, and may have been a case of "mistranslation".


I just found this funny since there was a discussion a while back concerning this very thing between Prinny Supervisor and other users where the consensus was on the opposite. That Chloe would have been incorrect with Kuroe being correct.

Any thoughts regarding this accusation of mistranslation, especially from Prinny Supervisor if possible? As far as I've seen, either one works since there isn't an official romanization.

EDIT:

I decided to do some investigation and managed to find a Japanese LP of the game that actually showed Kuroe's name in English at some point. There, it was actually romanized as Kuroe as well. It's shows it on the upper-left corner of her Punishment/Motivation screen.

So that accusation was actually just full of hot air. Then again, I guess I shouldn't be surprised.



I remember that discussion.
I honestly don't agree with "Kuroe" being left as is as purely a mistranslation.
[クロエ] is, to the Japanese speaker at least, phonetically identical to the western "Chloe" or native "Kuroe".
Linguistically, and logically, either pronunciation is fine for localization purposes so long as it "makes sense to the audience" and "doesn't get in the way of the character's context in any major way".

A similar issue is with Lily, but honestly, since most of the names are spelled in Katakana in the same vein as using bold/italics in English...the context issue is a moot point unless NIS expressed otherwise.

That just leaves it as an issue of "what makes more sense to western ears and phonetic tendencies".
So called purists can argue that all they like, but to me at least...either would've been fine since the context was never made explicit and/or was irrelevant to begin with.
________
As for Yurine...she honestly doesn't strike me as a highschooler...at all. I can totally see her as mediocre college girl so it's not that huge a deal *if* she was aged up slightly...though the age 18 argument doesn't matter here either since being 18 or so wouldn't matter between senior year of high school and first year college student.

A little clarity there with the original text would be nice, since I am curious though.

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Re: Thoughts about the game...etc, etc (Story, gameplay, characters...the usual)

Postby Sleepyprinny99 » Tue Nov 15, 2016 11:16 am

After ruminating on the casts between the two games...and trying to decide which cast I liked better...
I'm gonna have to go with 2.

Unlike 1, there's nobody I dislike in 2.

Dammit, even Lily was awesome...

Minor rant over and omitting details unless asked.

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Re: Thoughts about the game...etc, etc (Story, gameplay, characters...the usual)

Postby Prinny Supervisor » Tue Nov 15, 2016 12:36 pm

Just a few notes!

Was Yurine talking about "college" in the past or her plans for the future? Do you remember the exact conversation? I don't remember changing any grades/schools, but it's possible.

Yeah, the "Chloe" wiki entry is...a little odd. The spelling we got direct from the NIS version was "Kuroe", not "Chloe", so we kept it. Actually, the only name that is different from the NIS version is "Riri" to "Lily", because I reasoned that "Lily" was a better fit for her character and I didn't want players to mispronounce her name as "Ree ree" or something similar.
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razisgosu
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Re: Thoughts about the game...etc, etc (Story, gameplay, characters...the usual)

Postby razisgosu » Thu Nov 17, 2016 4:25 pm

Prinny Supervisor wrote:Just a few notes!

Was Yurine talking about "college" in the past or her plans for the future? Do you remember the exact conversation? I don't remember changing any grades/schools, but it's possible.

Yeah, the "Chloe" wiki entry is...a little odd. The spelling we got direct from the NIS version was "Kuroe", not "Chloe", so we kept it. Actually, the only name that is different from the NIS version is "Riri" to "Lily", because I reasoned that "Lily" was a better fit for her character and I didn't want players to mispronounce her name as "Ree ree" or something similar.


It was during the Sunken World zone, when fighting the girls shadows and past, I believe it was in a conversation with some of Yurine's friends/acquaintances from her past. Now that I've beaten the game I think college is probably right. It's just a very rare thing to see college in Japanese media so it made me raise an eyebrow.

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Re: Thoughts about the game...etc, etc (Story, gameplay, characters...the usual)

Postby Sleepyprinny99 » Tue Nov 22, 2016 9:54 pm

Prinny Supervisor wrote:
Yeah, the "Chloe" wiki entry is...a little odd. The spelling we got direct from the NIS version was "Kuroe", not "Chloe", so we kept it. Actually, the only name that is different from the NIS version is "Riri" to "Lily", because I reasoned that "Lily" was a better fit for her character and I didn't want players to mispronounce her name as "Ree ree" or something similar.


Unlike like Kuroe's name, which phonetically, is fine either way I can get why and personally agree with Lily's name change...the reasons you mentioned are pretty sound and fall under the "it makes more sense to the ears" argument. Her name just has a lot of subtle things going on phonetically that would've made it hard to keep as is.

For one, /l/ and /r/ are virtually identical in Japanese and illustrates that the /r/ is....really different in Japanese than it is in English, it's closer to the Spanish back trilled /r/ than the usual English liquid /r/ we're used to. That and the vowels are kinda different, so despite the original spelling being [リリ] or [Riri] her name would still sound like the English [Lily] even in Japanese. My point is, changing the name with that in mind shows a lot of thought towards the audience since, some folks might assume otherwise based on spelling.

As for Yurine, I think the conversation in question was in the Sunken World block.


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